138: How to Restart Your Career with Jason Tartick

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In this episode we get to do a little Bachelor nation fangirling while also getting invaluable career and financial advice from the one and only, Jason Tartick! Jason is the founder of Restart, a company centered on career navigation and money management. In this episode we talk about what a career restart is and how to mindfully make changes in our career path. Jason’s advice on how to make a career transition gracefully is perfect for our new agent audience. We get Jason’s take on some of our favorite topics as well: boundaries, hustle, comparison and much more! Jason’s new book, The Restart Roadmap: Rewire and Restart Your Career, is now available for pre-order! Connect with Jason @jason_tartick on social media and check out his podcast, Trading Secrets!
Jason is the host of a top charting business podcast, Trading Secrets. He is the founder of Restart, a career management and personal financial consulting company. His Restart All Access group has created international networking opportunities for those focused on career navigation and small business startups. In addition he is an investor in a financial trading app and a social media talent agency. He has utilized his professional platform to speak on a wide array of subjects at universities and corporate associations.

The following is a rough transcript provided by Otter.ai.

Now Mike, you gotta be shitting me like, Well, how am I gonna do what am I going to do here? You’re asking the wrong guy. The admins like oh, your gums in the good kisser. That is so well said because you’re rereading. You’re like what the hell was I thinking? deceptive.

Hi, y’all welcome to hustle humbly. It’s

Alyssa and Katie and we are two top producing realtors in the Baton Rouge market. We work for two different companies where we should be competitors. But we have chosen community over competition. The goal of our podcast is to encourage you to find your own way in business to stop comparing yourself and start embracing your strengths. Hi, Alyssa. Hey, Katie. It’s episode 138. Okay, we have a special guest. This is our first celebrity. Yeah,

I know. It’s a big deal.

Jason’s laughing cuz he’s like, It’s not that serious.

It is a big deal. Big deal to us. Especially because we are bachelor fans.

Yeah. Okay. So Jason, tell the people who you are so that they can get excited with us.

Well, thank you guys for having me. My name is Jason Tarik. I was born and raised in Buffalo, New York was a corporate banker before I took a wild detour and went on that show called The Bachelorette and I finished up third on season I always joke around got the bronze medal, third on Becca season, and that was season 14, I believe. And then as a result of that, there was a couple of us up for discussion about being the next bachelor, and they decided to go with Colton Underwood. And so Caitlin Brisco. Yeah, former bachelorette came out to Seattle and was doing some interviewing for a podcast. And Caitlyn, you know, interviewed me to just say what’s next? And ironically enough, what was next was right in front of me. And I’m engaged now to Caitlyn Bristow, we live in Nashville, Tennessee. And yeah, we are right in the heart, a dead center epicenter of bachelor nation.

Yeah, that’s true. They like flocked to that area. Yeah.

Yeah. Now it seems like right now Nashville, New York. Chicago. LA is like the predominant way now actually, a lot of people are going to Texas, you’re seeing a lot like bachelor. Yeah, I think Chris Harrison and

see that? Yeah. Yeah. Okay. That’s funny. All right. So let’s kind of maybe also tell our audience about what you do now what what your job is, what your business is, and how you kind of help your community?

For sure. So there’s actually a little bit of a story behind it. But for you know, nine years, almost 10 years almost, I was a corporate banker, I relocated four times my longest and biggest move was from New York to Seattle, I moved to Seattle, not knowing one human for a promotion. And I got seven promotions, I was the yes guy, you tell me where to go, how to go, I’m going to do it. You tell me to get my MBA at night, I’ll do it. I was that guy, until I burnt out. And inevitably, if you’re not listening to kind of like your inner voice and in yourself within your business and your construct of who you are, you too might burn out and I went on the show The Bachelorette against the approval of every person. In my corner. My friends, my family, they’re like, Dude, what are you doing? You got a rocket ship on your back? Why are you doing this, I’m like, you know, for the first time in 10 years, I’m doing something because I want to do it, even though it’s not the logical blueprint thing to do. So I completely broke the blueprint, went back to corporate America. And a story that I tell in my book, which is now out for pre sales, called the restart roadmap, that I really haven’t told many people is that after a year of working back for the bank, Caitlin made a PG 13 rated type comment and one of her confessions about our relationship, it hits some of the headlines. And this was literally the first the first bump I really had with this company in 10 years. And they put me in this ultimate ultimatum, which was, you either have to restart your career at the bank. And if you do that, no more side hustle, no more social media, no more podcast, eliminate it all. Or you can go restart yourself outside of the bank. And so I chose to go restart myself outside the bank. And not only that, I choose to do that. But I created a company called restart to really help people refine their career tracks and restart themselves, both from a career management perspective, and a career and a personal literate financial literacy perspective. And under that restart umbrella, we have built a lot of different entities in the business, which is, you know, making an impact over a million eyeballs a week, which is exciting.

That is amazing. One thing I really like about your podcasts in general is that you’re always very transparent about numbers and logistics of how things worked. When you were making these changes. Were you just living off of savings, like how were you able to survive during the transition periods and starting up everything? For

sure. Yeah, so the podcast, it’s called trading secrets and that’s like one of the many different prongs under restart and like He said, one of the big things we do is we talk about money, myself and our guests, we talk about our wins or losses, because behind every dollar earned or lost, there’s usually a really good story that goes with it. But we have this theory that we’re trying to crack that in society. It’s, it’s not a societal norm to talk about money, it is a no, no, it’s shunned away, when really, when we talk about it, if we do it in a healthy way, it’s such a good way for us to learn more, so we can all navigate our lives accordingly. But for me, I had and I talked about this in my book, you know, 10 years of working pretty hard. What the reason I went to Seattle before the show is I was I was 29. And I got a signing bonus was $110,000, my base was $165,000. And then I had upside to you more than potentially double the base on the output within that role. So I knew if I stayed there, I did all the math, I knew if I stayed there for two years, I already had going into it, I already had my MBA debt taken care of, and my undergrad debt paid off. So I knew that for two years based on like my budgeting plan, I would be indebted to the bank, I would have no I’m sorry, I would have no debt to the bank. So because they what they do with the signing bonuses they keep you on. So after two years, all that debt was clear, I wouldn’t know anything in the bank. And if I budgeted accordingly, I’d have the financial freedom to go do with what I want. And because I knew by the time I went to Seattle, my time was running alone, I was burning out. So when I transitioned over to what I’m doing now, all my entrepreneurship, I was actually double dipping for one full year. So what I call the double dipping years, I was pursuing all my entrepreneurship and opportunities and speaking at events and sponsorships and building the small business, as I was still working full time. And by the time it all came to a head and I had the end up leaving the bank, I was actually in a much better financial position than I even anticipated. As part of my plan when I first moved to Seattle.

Okay, so that makes perfect sense. And when a lot of agents get into real estate as a second career, so a lot of times it’s the same as what you’re talking about, they try to figure out well, how long can I stay in my full time job and still do this basically, as my side hustle that I’m planning to move towards in the future? And so I think there’s a lot of parallels in the logistics of that. What kind of advice would you give to someone who is in a current full time maybe a corporate type job, and then they’re, they’re working towards going into something else? Like how long or just general advice on that transition?

Yeah, that especially with real estate, right, because as a residential real estate agent, it’s kind of like, what you kill. So you’re not living off this like cushy base. And so I do think creating that type of runway for yourself is huge. But as you guys know, in that business, it’s like a slow snowball, right, it takes a long time to get that snowball going. But once you do, you’ve created referral sources and a business and credibility and a brand. And it just starts coming to you. And you don’t have to so much go for it. But in that beginning part, when you’re starting out, it is going to take insane discipline. And this is with anything this is even with a podcast, this is literally with any new venture, it’s going to take insane discipline, it’s going to take ultimate consistency, that is a must. And it’s going to take really tactful strategic moves. And because you only have now this goes two ways, you have 168 hours in a week, that’s a whole hell of a lot. But you only have 168 hours in a week, and you have to take care of yourself and personal matters as well. So you have to be very tactful with how you’re building your business. And the two things that I think most people don’t do, is they’re not consistent with how they do what they’re doing. And they’re not disciplined and making sure they’re getting done what they have to get done to get where they want to be.

I agree with that so much. And it’s funny because I started real estate when I was 21. And I’m 33 Now, when I was 21, I looked like I was 14. And so even now when new agents come into our industry, and they say but how do you do what you’re doing? And I tell them I’m on year 11? You know, I’m going into year 12. This I am not where you are and when I was where you are, I was hustling. And I was working as much as I could for free a lot of times just trying to learn and train. And the answer that you just gave is the answer that I give. And it is not the answer that people like, no, they want this secret. Yeah, they want the secret. What’s the secret? Yeah, they think that you are where you are because of some magic formula or something that I do every day. But they they don’t typically like the answer that it takes time. It takes discipline it takes saving your money and having a plan. I think that answer is very overwhelming to people and that is why the success ratio is so small. Let’s

tell Jason because he probably doesn’t know what is this. So?

Yes, so three out of 10 People who get licensed as a realtor make it two year, three,

three, year three. So 70% Fail 70% Fail by year three. And what’s crazy is so many people I think are doing their restart because of COVID. Sure, and just the changes in the world in the last two years. So 2020 and 2021 180,000, people in the United States have gotten their real estate license. Wow. It’s like way more than anyone has ever. So now there’s over 1.5 million realtors in the United States.

Oh, my gosh, that is a fun fact, I did not know. And you think about that burnout rate. That’s the same thing you see in some large corporate even we’re now seeing it in a lot of professional type industries, like doctors and dentists and things like that. You’re seeing it all over. You think about what could be done today, what could be done right now, to proactively prepare yourself to not be one of those burnouts. And people just don’t do enough due diligence, and what they’re wanting to do or how they’re going to do it, or have a conversation with people like you before they go in. And think about the time that’s wasted when you’ve deployed effort, money, resources, and your personal life to something that you know, isn’t the right fit. And I just think so many people out there have to start being more proactive with due diligence before they saw say, oh, real estate sounds fun, I saw that my buddy just made 70 grand on one big commission, there’s more to that story, right? And you got to do it, you got to do that due diligence.

The barrier to entry to become a real estate agent is very low. It’s a simple test, you could take the course online in three weeks, and now you’re licensed, but people don’t often think past that. Okay, now I’m licensed. Now, what? Do I just have business? There is no salary, where are you going to get the business. And so the I agree that the planning of what’s next people aren’t thinking long term, they’re just thinking in the moment of, I need to do something, this is the quickest and the easiest thing, but they don’t realize what it takes. And what’s funny about it being a failed ratio of 70% in the first three years is that year three, is when you finally start getting your momentum of repeat and referral. And people are like, wow, that person is here to stay as a realtor. They have been working all these years, I think they actually have some credibility now. And it seems like just when people get on that edge, they quit. But in the same note, we always say that your year countdown doesn’t start until you’re doing what you’re supposed to be doing. Right. So if you’ve been a realtor for five years, but you haven’t been putting in the work, building your database, hosting the open houses reaching out to your clients, like you have to start doing that now. And now your three year clock begins. It’s not like you can just sit

back for three. Yeah, it doesn’t automatically come

exactly. And I think one story I have to that connects to exactly what you just said, in the stories, both encouraging and discouraging, however, perceived. It was the worst interview I’ve ever had on trading secrets. So I’m going to put that out there. I hate to bash up but it was the worst interview I had. But this was a story I’ll still never forget.

I’m wondering, I listen to it because I haven’t heard it hasn’t

been really I don’t even know if I can release it. That’s how, but it was way. So it was with Josh Flagg and Josh Flagg for anybody in the real estate businesses on Bravo’s Million Dollar Listing. I mean, he’s an extremely successful resident luxury la based residential real estate agent who has done over a half billion dollars in deals so extremely successful. But the reason it wasn’t a great interview is because Josh is very confident in who he is. And I don’t know that trading his career and money, tactics and secrets are really his forte, and I’ll give you an example. And I think anybody that’s listening to this, that’s considering the business or in the business could take something away from it. But I said to him, I said, Josh, listen, Forbes 30, under 30, you’ve you’ve done over a half billion dollars in deals, you’re literally the top one of the top brokers in the entire planet. Like people are going to listen to this and they’re going to look up to your success in they’re going to want to find something they can replicate something they could take away to potentially do it themselves. What type of advice would you have for them? You just kind of like Boss, he’s like looking all over. It’s like, my advice would be don’t get into business, just like that. I was like, Okay, so like no, like, inspiration or insight? No. Okay. Don’t do it. Don’t do it. Why? Yeah. Why though, Josh? Why? What’s, you know, what’s the deal here? And Josh says, well, Well, here’s the deal. There’s just no way to replicate me because there’s only one me and no one will ever be as good as me. Like, okay. All right, I respect that. Let’s drill down further. Josh, why are you so good? Like, tell? Explain to me your answer. And what you simply said in very simple words was, there’s not one human in the planet that will know my market better than me. Every street. I know, every single every single piece of property. I know the person I know the family, I know who owned it, I know what it’s going for. And he was a pretty much saying that’s my differentiating factor. So don’t try and be me, because you’ll never be me. And I think that’s encouraging. Right. It’s encouraging, but it’s also discouraging, the encouraging part, I think with that is if you are a real estate agent, you better damn well find out what is your Josh flag? What is your differentiator, that can that can separate you from the 1.5 million and I don’t if you can identify that, I think that process becomes even tougher and longer to see that window of success. I would agree that’s a

great story. Because the funny part of that is what he told me was the reason is anyone can learn information. It wasn’t it wasn’t about his personality type or his like process. It was literally I know things well, anyone can know things you can learn, you can learn that anyone can learn. And we talk about that a lot on the show that if you’re not willing to just literally learn the market, you’re never going to have competence. You’re never going to have information that that makes your clients feel comfortable working with you. So

yeah, we always say like confidence is key. But that only comes from training learning, the more knowledgeable you are you just all of a sudden radiate confidence, because you’ve done it before, which sometimes can come with experience and effort. Yeah, but anybody could really get there.

Oh, for sure. Right. I selfishly don’t want you to release that interview now so that we can have like a little behind the scenes. That’s so that’s so funny. Okay, so one of the focuses of our show is to stop comparing yourself and to start kind of embracing who you are and your strengths, which kind of plays into that that story. What was your experience, like with comparison at your corporate job? And kind of how did that affect you? And how does that affect you? Now? I mean, even being in in the field you’re in now, as an entrepreneur, there’s still comparison.

For sure. I think the problem with most of my career in corporate banking is I was so focused, and this is one of my biggest regrets is I cared too much about what people thought. And I was trying to look a certain way, speak a certain way, act a certain way, work a certain way. And that way, was the way I thought other people identified what success looked like. So rather than just being me rather than talking in my tone, rather than dressing and appearing the way I thought made sense, I was always trying to customize it to what I thought success would be in the eyes of the the person in front of me the issue with that is you’re staying so high level with everything, you’re never really building a true connection. You’re not building a true relationship, because human connection is based on vulnerability, you shared experiences, being real, being authentic, being genuine. And when you’re continuing to put on this front, you’re really not impressing anyone, and if anything, you are putting a roadblock in front of your success to truly build relationships. But the whole I think impostor syndrome is a real thing, right? Like comparing yourself and and maybe losing confidence because of what you see around you. And I felt that a lot of times in corporate America and you know, even I talked about this in the book, I felt imposter syndrome when I walked right through the doors of that bachelor mansion. I mean, I’m walking in the door, as confident as I can be based on you know, my friend group and my little circle out of Buffalo and Rochester, New York. I’m doing okay for myself. It all of a sudden I look around and every single guy is you know, six foot four jacked out of their mind. Then I start talking to him and I’m like, so what’s your story? I had AFL player Harlem Globetrotters MLB player MLS player, we had a freakin we had the fourth employee of Venmo the thought one of the founders of Venmo I mean I’m not making this stuff up. And their stories just keep getting like crazy. I you know, Colton, like a Ken Barbie doll six four beautiful guy football player. Then he drops me he’s a virgin. I’m like, you gotta be shitting me like where am I gonna do? What am I gonna do? A unicorn? Yeah, like what the heck? And so I think through all those experiences, what I’ve learned is you really have to do self examination right down to the bedrock of who you are. And it goes back to

Raman that’s looking at us. I need to know that’s

Robin right. Look at him modeling. Hey, Robin, totally modeling. No.

You’re part of the podcast now, buddy. Yeah.

cameo. We had a kid.

Now his way To get his talent wants attention on it.

Well, I will say as a Enneagram. Three, I do struggle with worrying about how I am being perceived and like, Am I successful and how much success is enough and like I want to achieve all the things I it is something that I’m constantly having to check myself one. What do you have any tips for over like, I find myself when I’m feeling overwhelmed. In that situation, I almost get like frozen and I have struggled, I struggled to make process to move forward and make progress because I’m worried about what people may think or even when we started the podcast, it almost was a thing for me where people are gonna think, well, she’s in real estate, why is she doing something else? Why is she doing a side hustle? Or why is this happening? And obviously, it worked out and I’m in a good place with it. But there are times where I felt like because of imposter syndrome, like who am I to have a podcast? Or who am I to do this? Or that, that I just couldn’t make progress? How do you overcome like the mental block of moving forward even when you’re feeling anxious about what you’re doing?

Yeah, I think the one thing that’s two things here, one that’s critical as you gotta understand, when you’re in that room, when you’re in that conversation, there is something about you there is something special that’s different than every single person in that room, identify it, lean into it. The second thing I’ll tell you, and this is what the lessons I’ve learned from some of the biggest invest in this world, multibillionaire Mark Laurie and a rod, this both came from them, so I’m stealing their tips here. But when you’re feeling any bit of that anxiousness or like you’re in a roadblock, or you’re scared, or you’re worried, most people will use fear to drive their complacency in this day, and to not make the move when you feel that I want you to do the opposite. I want you to step into it full speed. If that anxious feeling is coming on about not talking, you’re stepping up, step up with a crazy idea step right into it. Because all these guys have said that they have lived their life. Like when I asked Mark Laurie, there’s 3500 billionaires in the world, you came from nothing, he came from nothing. How are you one of 3500 billionaires in the world, when we have 8 billion people like what how. And so what he said is like, the way he lives, his life is in the sixth gear. And I want to there’s some takeaways from it that we could all apply. The idea of this is the only way you’re gonna get more information is if you act on things, if you try a podcast, if you try to get into real estate, is if you do say something in the meeting, even though you feel uncomfortable, if you do ask for an introduction, when it might not feel, you know, like, the best time or whatever. Because every experience you have, you quickly get in more information to learn and then adapt. And so what his theory is, is that my whole life, I just went all in all in all in all the time I stepped into it, that I was then getting more information back. And as a result of that I was getting more learning lessons about me and the people around me than some person might not get in for lifetimes, because they were using fear as a means of not stepping into it. So all these things, go for it, try it, say it. And the second you get feedback. Listen, though, because though you now have more information to adjust your next approach, it’s the people that get the feedback and fall on their face rather than using it as constructive, constructive opportunity to adjust what they’re doing.

That’s wonderful. That was real. I just made a ton of notes. She’s feverishly

writing her notes over here. Hey, Alyssa, Hey, Katie, what do we mentioned almost every episode, email template, you’re right, we sure do. And after every time, we mentioned an email template, do you know what we get

emails asking if they can have copies of the email template,

send me a copy of that template? I would like that, that sounds great. And you know what the good news is, you can get all of our email templates from our course, email templates, one on one, tell the people about it,

our course has all of the email templates you would need to send to your buyers and your sellers and your clients that are buying and selling at the same time. Exactly. To get through every step of the transaction and giving them information that they need for where they are in the transaction. It’s great because you never forget to tell them something. Yeah. So we’ve already done all the work for you. Yeah, we wrote them and you can personalize them. Yes. And just feel organized, knowing that you have all the information where it needs to

be. And if you purchase email templates, 101, you do get lifetime access. So occasionally, we like to go in and make updates based on the market or if we find a new best practice. So we put that right into the template and you get that updated straightaway.

It just goes straight to your core. Yes.

It’s already there. It’s just already on there. You

don’t have to worry about it. Well, email will say updated. That’s great. Where can they find these email templates? You

can find the email templates at email templates with an S one Oh one.com Email Templates. One Oh, one.com. Yes, head over for reviews and all of the specifics. Wonderful. Okay, enjoy. Okay, I think that it’s funny because I feel like and that’s why I’ve always been drawn to you and vibed with what you’re doing. I mean, to me, you’re not just like a contestant off of The Bachelorette, which you’re talking about makes sense. And what you know, the advice you’re giving is, is good and carries over to lots of different people. What I want you to talk about because you’re so financially focused, what are some of the challenges you find that are the difference between being in the corporate world versus being an entrepreneur? Because realtors are sort of what they call that, like reluctant entrepreneurs, they think, Oh, I’m gonna go be a realtor, I’m going to sell houses. And then they realize that’s a small business, there’s nobody that tells you how to budget, how to market how to nobody tells you how to you have to wear all the hats. And it’s a lot like I think what what you’re doing it what any entrepreneur does, they have to wear all the hats for a long time, and maybe forever. What, what are some of the differences? And what are maybe some of the tips or takeaways?

I mean, yeah, the biggest difference is when I was working for a corporation, I would start my day thinking about how do I get through this day, right? Like, what am I going to do to check the box and meet the expectation so that I can get home quicker? Or go get a beer or go do something I want to do, right? When you’re an entrepreneur and you find out really, what is your motivating factor? Like if I put you on the spot right now I say what motivates you, and you’ve identified that you’ve done enough self examination to identify that it no longer becomes how do I get through this day and go do what I’m doing? It’s literally how do I maximize the most I can out of this 24 hours to make the greatest impact and move the chains forward for myself, my business, my life, my family more today than when I woke up this morning. Those are like the biggest factors. And the three biggest things I’ll say from a financial because you kind of touched on some of the financial pieces, the three things you have to do better than you ever did before when you’re on your own. One is you have to manage debt properly, when you’re in a small business and an entrepreneur debt can absolutely crush you. But debt can be the best thing for you as you do need capital to grow in certain companies in certain areas. That’s one, two is behavioral based budgeting. So you really have to understand where your money is going, why it’s going there. And what that tells you about you my tip for that, pull out two statements, your last two statements of your credit card transactions, and see for a minute, take 20 minutes, go through each line item. And rather than just looking at the dollars in the lines, try and draw some psychology out of this. Okay, I’m starting to see all right, spending a lot of the bar or wait a second spending a lot on luxury goods, or wait a second, I haven’t looked at, you know, my monthly renewable expenses, like there is so much you can learn about yourself in literally two months of credit card transactions that can help you better understand where you’re spending money, why you’re spending money, and if it makes sense. And then the third thing you have to do, you know, listen, this stat is crazy. 63% of people go their entire career, not a year, not a biannual review. 63% of people go their entire career without negotiating for their packages, their salaries and their bonuses. 63. When you are an entrepreneur, you have to negotiate everything, you have to negotiate your time, you have to negotiate where you’re spending your money, you have to negotiate potential resources to grow your business, you have to negotiate percentages, it’s nonstop negotiation every single second of the day. And those are the three big financial tips. And I think those are the biggest differences between entrepreneurial work and corporate work for me at least.

Yeah, that makes sense. Okay, so let’s just say you did a restart. Now a lot of our realtor friends have done or are doing a restart, when you make that leap when you’re doing that, like what do you think is the most important stuff to do in the beginning? Like, what’s the base level stuff that you need to do when you go from to becoming self employed?

Totally. So that I mean, that’s the question. The problem is people will just make the transition without thinking through it. You’re going to have to adjust what you’re doing in the beginning, based on why you made the transition. And I think people make the transition, I think there’s five big things, there’s five core competencies, they either aren’t getting mobility within their current career. So if you feel as though you’re not accelerating at the pace you want to whatever that may be, you then are going to have a different set of circumstances where you’ll start, right, that’s going to be the focus. Some people feel as though compensations the issue and so that would realign their focus. Some people think it’s a skill set, right? So that’s going to be a totally different thing. They don’t think that the the natural skill set that they have are being utilized within their job that’ll change how they restart some people. It’s just passion. And so making sure that you’re doing the things from the get go that are aligned with that excite Yeah. And something at some one of them is fear. And so a fear is the reason you haven’t done what you’ve done or the fear is the reason that you’re just getting out of it. To start, you’re going to have different tactics to get things going. But it’s all going to start people try it, and they put it all out there everywhere, all over the internet. There’s like this customized three step process. That’s not the case, there’s no cookie cutter solution that’s going to get your restart going. You have to really understand and I said the word before the bedrock, the bedrock of why you’re transitioning and what you want, based on what you’ve understood what you want, you have to put a plan in place, it’s going to be customized to you, and only you because it’s going to be different for you, Katie, and it’s going to be different for me. Mm hmm. Yes.

Yes, that makes sense. Okay, what is your definition of hustle. So as an entrepreneur, I think what we also struggle with is if you do find something you love, and you’re passionate about, then you also keep getting pulled back into it. Right? So we talk a lot on our show about boundaries. And actually, I mean, there’s no such thing as work life balance. But if you love what you’re doing now, like, let’s I assume you love what you’re doing now, do you find that sometimes you’re like, Oh, I just want to get back into it. Like, I want to work all day. Where do you pick up your boundaries?

How do you shut it off? Yeah. And have personal time.

You’re asking the wrong guy. It’s something I’m totally working on. And one thing that I like we’re we’re starting to do is recruiting like no phone time. So if we have certain because the phone is the biggest distraction right in the world. And so I think what we’ll do is we’ll have dinner, Caitlin, and I will have dinner we’ll have, you know, a game night. And we’ll literally just say, phones out. I have another friend who has a no phone room, which is the coolest thing. So there’s a room in his house that he’s like, made this like extremely cool Zen room. It’s got everything him and his wife like and when you enter that room, you can you have to check your phone at the door. So that that is that’s a really big one. And then I think that the hustle question is like when you’re when you’re constantly thinking about your tactic and your strategy, and I think there’s so many people out there that are just being order takers, and not really thinking thoroughly, of how they can get in front of the people they need to get in front of, and how they can make the changes that they want to. And they’re just, you know, if you’re repeating the same thing someone’s doing, you’re gonna get very similar results. And if you’re expecting different results, you’re gonna have to take a different approach and that’s where true hustle comes in. I think speaking of

just maintaining like your relationship with Caitlin and your friends and family, going from just the ordinary guy working at a bank to going on The Bachelor and then making it as far as you did, at what point did you feel the difference in being like famous like was it right when you write when the show ended and people started like so I listened to the episode you did with the girl who the bachelor data Oh, I did the Excel where she like tracks how many followers people get and all of this and really, you’re you were a little bit before she started tracking all of this. But I imagine like one day did you just get on your social media and go oh, my gosh, I have fall like what? What was that transition from being ordinary banker to a celebrity still trying to go back to work to a bank, but now people know who I am like, what what did that even look like?

That was a wild roller coaster. Right? So I’ll tell you that story. I’m on my way back from the plane. I finally get my phone back and I text my boss is his name was Shawn shot. I’m going to be back on Monday. And he’s like, Oh, we’re excited to have you back. Congratulations. Hope everything worked out. And that was it. And then over the weekend, or on Monday morning, he’s like, Hey, I got here early. I just want to let you know there’s been rumors around security here that there might be paparazzi or someone like trying to get spoilers. I was like, What the hell like that was I’m like, Excuse me, like I you know, this is before social media, the show aired, and I was like, What the hell is going on? And then the funny thing is, then my expectations like what is happening here, but I wasn’t on the show for the first six weeks, like I was nowhere to be found. So that I had this like, extremely like, humbling moment. I’m like, Okay, this is just like, All right, cool, little show, check it off, keep keep working. And then I had this one on one day, that went really well. And, you know, the general public of that was watching it. It really gravitated to the story. And I can relatable and then you know, the next day, I could go on six weeks shows on nothing, you know, okay, I’m good.

No, work at this time while

while it’s your show up every day, show up every day, right? And then I’m walking to work and then someone’s like, Jason, like looked at like, oh, it’s up and then like two steps later, someone says yeah, and then like four steps later, someone’s like, I get a pleasure. I’m like, wait a second. What? And this was just after Episode Six. he sounds like he’s happening. And it took a long time to like, really process all that. And the moment I’ll never forget is it was after like, I don’t know, Becca made a comment about me being a good kisser or something. And so the next day I was like, you know, I’m watching this and now I gotta go to work. I go to work and the admins like, Oh, your gums in the good kisser. Oh, okay, what? Oh, no. So the worlds collided a little bit and I don’t call I don’t like, you know, Caitlin. And I don’t really like say like celebrity or famous, we just say like, familiar face, from, you know, television from a television show. And it was

when y’all go to dinner without being bothered? Probably not.

It just depends where, you know, it just depends where there is definitely a specific demographic that watches the show. And you could definitely go places where that demographic probably wouldn’t be and you go to places where they will be and you’ll get you know, you’ll get a hello here like,

what are we in the mood for tonight?

Yeah, we’re gonna go to Broadway and go bounced by bachelorette to bachelorette party and say, Hello. Or we’re gonna go in the hole in the wall down the road where, you know, the biker bar? We’re not one human knows about the bachelor? Yeah,

at least you have that option. I guess. That’s so funny.

Do you feel like as far as humility goes, and having to like, check yourself from going from what you were to such a big success pretty quickly. I mean, how do you go from Wow, now I can afford like more house and better cars? And like, how do you do that while keeping like your logical hat on and not overdoing it?

I think the great thing about my background is in finance, and you know, it’s like so I have an MBA in finance and accounting. And I was a banker, right for 10 years. So I understand the importance of money. I understand the statistics of bankruptcy. And I totally have analyzed you know, all the the statistics about bankruptcy and like professional athletes. And while our world for Caitlin and I has been we’ve been very fortunate in the last three, four years, Caitlin five, six years, you just never know when that when those things burn out. And when that can end. So we live. So under our income right now. We just had a meeting with our accountant where he was very, he called us both very frugal, but you know what that puts us in a position for the rainy day, next year, the year after? Or when, you know, this little switch turns off? Hopefully it will, we’ll be in a good position. And right now we are so it’s yeah, it’s crazy. I think the other thing too, not just financially and being humble about what you’re doing, but also with your ego. Keeping that in check is super important. And I think whether it’s reality show and you know, people start calling your name overnight, or it’s just someone in your community that’s having a lot of success. We all know that people when I lived in my little town in Rochester that walked around thinking they were literally, you know, they walked around like multibillionaire, they mark that they walked around like their mark, Laurie and Mark Laurie wear sweatshirts and sweat suits and doesn’t walk around like that. I think regardless, if it’s like small town, I’m arrogant, or it’s like a class delivered celebrity. I think I’m untouchable. It is so important that every human checks themselves. And I think the way to do that is to make sure that like your core, your board of directors, the circles you swim in, are really good people. That’s your life’s work. And those people know you to it. And they’re, they’re gonna keep you in check. And for me, for me and my family, friends, and my little board directors constantly, maybe over does it keeps keeps us in check.

That’s awesome. I think that was all of our main questions that we had.

Yeah, for sure. Oh, that was so great.

I have so many notes. I’m just so thankful that you came. I am so humbled that you’re here with us today. And it was

so wonderful.

Yeah. So much fun to connect with you guys. And thank you for having me. And yeah,

okay. So before you go, I want you to tell us all about the book. So I know that the book is on pre order now. So kind of walk us through. I know you’ve mentioned it during the show, but tell us about the book so that everyone knows where they can get the book.

Yeah. Okay, so you can get the book on Amazon right now. Preorder. It’s the restart roadmap, and you could preorder it now. And then once it is out, it’ll be out on April 5, you’ll be able to get it at the targets Barnes and Nobles and things like that. But what I would say is it’s a guide for anyone that’s rethinking any bit of their professional track. It could be the most immaterial thing that you’re rethinking your conversations with your boss. getting along better with your colleagues maybe working on your personal brand, or it could be is massively materials completely changing your industry Thinking rethinking where you live and why this book has an eight step roadmap to help you do that and some of this stuff, right? There’s a lot of how to career books out there. So if someone said to me, what do you think is differentiating about this book, I would tell you, one, it’s entertaining. I tell it’s a lot of theory. But it’s theory backed by stories from behind the curtain of reality TV, some stories in Hollywood, and some office experiences with what Forbes called some of the most powerful people and rank them in banking. So from Wall Street to Hollywood, to the perspective we actually see in our homes on Main Street. There’s a lot of theory, stories, and every single chapter in the eight step roadmap has specific takeaways that you can implement right now. So whether you use all eight chapters for the roadmap, or you use just a few takeaways, there’s definitely something in this book for you.

That’s awesome. So did you do an audio version where you read it?

I did. And let me tell you, I’m an honest guy. It sucked.

But process the process?

Yes. Oh, the process. So like, I’m so glad I did it. And it’s one of those things, I listen back and be like, Oh, my God, I was worth it. But I’m also like, super realistic with things. And I’m very candid and open and honest. You’re sitting in this like little room. And it’s six hour sessions, right? And so you’re reading the whole time, but it’s not, you know, think about when you read a book, you read quick, maybe you skip a couple words, because you can, you know, just figure out what’s what’s your speed reading, right? This you have to go through each line and say it within the right pauses and tone increases and decreases and pullbacks. So you’ll be reading the line and in your little headphones back. Yep, you got to reread that. So you can read it again. Note we need more inflection on the interior.

It Yes, it’s where’s this way too long. It should be like one hour max that you would

never finish?

Well, it took three sessions, you had to do three sessions of that back to back. So like at the end of it, like your jaws hurt your neck is that I’m just like this.

And then you’re like really analyzing what you’ve written?

Yeah, total change anything. That is that is so well said because you’re rereading. You’re like what the hell was I think the sentence like, what was like what was going through my head? And then I’ll like, stop and say that and the readers like, Hey, we’re still recording. Oh my gosh.

Have you ever listened to any of Gary V’s audiobooks, he? Oh, my God, you have to listen to one he listened to crushing it or crushing it. And he goes off script all of the time. And he’ll be like, yeah, so book people listen, and then he’ll just he’ll change what he like he literally will change what he wrote. But he’ll keep the text that he wrote, and then he’ll just go off script off script. So it’s actually more beneficial to listen to the audiobook than to read the hardcopy, because he is, and especially in crushing it and crush it. They’re talking about social media. So it’s always changing, right? So after he wrote it, then he’s recording this audio book a year to two years later, wow. He’s like having to update the actual, you know, like, LinkedIn or whatever, like, whatever he wants to talk. He’s like, well, so now I’m talking about this, or now I’m talking about tick tock or like, but it’s wild how often he goes, as he calls it off script, I use your profit

margin different if people buy the audio version versus a hardcopy? I don’t. I mean, audio books are expensive. So I didn’t know if it even mattered for you.

I don’t think so. So I know. So I don’t think so. One of the things is with so I’m with HarperCollins. And how it works is you get an advance. And then with the advance, you can do whatever you want with it, you can use it for anything you want, you can just take it and if you don’t sell a copy, you still get that money. And then as you for every book that’s sold audio, or hardcover or paperback, a percentage goes, a big percentage goes to pay that advanced back. And once they get that advanced dollar back, you then make a percentage on top of whatever that is. So if I don’t sell one book, I still have my advance. If I sell, I don’t know, maybe it’s 2000 books, maybe that number isn’t hit. So I still have my advance by sell 5000 books. It exceeds, you know, I’m just coming up this time I have but maybe that exceeds my advance and then I start to make a percentage of every book sold after that. So you

make zero until he already made the money. Right? Right. Right. But you’re not getting any they’re not It’s not like 5050 until you get your until they meet it. It’s like nothing until you meet it because you already got it and paycheck. Yeah, so

you signed the deal. And then the lump sum of money is negotiated right? And then the book deal was like a big publisher like this will work is there’s gonna be certain times where a percentage of that is released, so 1/3 of it was released. When I signed the deal. Another 1/3 of this lump sum was released. least when I submitted the manuscript, and the last 1/3 was released when the manuscript script got approved. So all that money then I now have, and if you know, I’m doing like a book tour, so it’ll be expenses there and some marketing stuff and, you know, I can do with whatever I want. But if you don’t sell one book, they don’t they can’t take any of that back. And then if you exceed the advance in sales, then you would get a percentage of that once that is met. Okay.

Makes sense? Well, I love

audiobooks, especially when it’s read by the person who wrote it, because I just want to hear the person. Yeah, that’s the only time I can really do it. But I just makes you feel like you know, you even know that.

Well, you get connection there. Yeah, sure. Speaking of listening to you, your podcast is so good. Yes. It is called trading secrets. So we are obviously talking to our podcast listeners. So their podcast people, they will go and listen, I want to tell you my favorite episode, and I have not listened to all of them. And then I want you to tell me your favorite episode that you’ve recorded because I what my mind was literally blown with Rob deer deck. I have shared that episode with so many people. Like just the way he was hacking his life and gamifying everything and his like long term vision and how he registered and thought about happiness. And, you know, like, what’s his spouse? Think? And how do you feel today? And how did you eat? It was just like, literally, I My mind was completely blown.

Yeah, if you asked me, What was the most life changing episode, what was like the greatest impact episode? That episode literally changed my life. And I say it changed my life because even the way I operate like how he gamified his life is exact. I do it every single day. I’m looking at my file right now that was created all because of that podcast. 456-789-1011 12 1314. I have 14 inputs that I put in every single band and Excel file, all because of that episode. So that one was a life changing episode. I’d encourage everyone to go listen to that. If you’re into investing and stuff. A very eye opening episode was we had a kid on his name’s Hugh Henny, he was a student and he became a day trader, he was making so much money than the middle of his finance test as a senior. He did look in one of his options hit. And he had one he’s better than that one. He had been up 700. And like 26k for that day. And he told his boss, he told his professor, I gotta go to the professor said to him, if you show me that you’re up to $726,000. Today, I’ll let you go. And he showed him his p&l, and he was let them go. And he got an A, and he tells his whole story. And then I would say we talked a little bit about finance today. So while there’s a lot of entertaining podcasts with like different celebrities, like we had a rat on and some reality TV stars, and like Kevin O’Leary from Shark Tank, a real cool one is the points guy. So that episode just released and essentially, if you have a credit card, I would recommend you listen to this episode because he talks about the points that you earn on your credit card. And the fact that this is literally a currency and no one myself included guy that’s prides himself on finance, no one is managing their currency to the pinnacle of what they can be doing with their points. And so he has a lot of tips tricks, and he built this business in two years. He was making 75k Working at Morgan Stanley and HR. He started doing it when he was there. Two years after he started two years after he started he exited for eight figures. And so he tells his success story and how you can really get in the game on your credit card. So the points guy episodes a good one, two, wow, have you if you’re in Netflix, tell us a tip. This one’s good. Because if you’re into like suppose you’re like I’m not into the finance stuff, but you’re into like current pop culture, relevancy, and money that Tinder swindler we had one of the girls on from the tinder swindler, and she tells the whole story of how she got taken for 300k. And if you’ve ever been taken, or you’re trying to teach someone that needs to cross their t’s and dot their eyes, there are a lot of lessons from hers from her vantage point.

Wild. This was Do you love podcasting?

I love it. I love it. It’s great.

You just never know what you’re gonna learn. You never know

what you’re gonna learn and who you can connect with. And yeah, you’re a talker, which you’re obviously a talker and we’re obviously talkers because mostly we just talk to each other so our podcast we only have a guest maybe on every fourth or fifth episode and the rest of them are us talking to each other. But it’s just so fun so fun. So you guys need to go listen to trading secrets because it’s really really

good and for like the bachelor fans and reality TV I like that you actually go into the logistics of what did we get paid to go on The Bachelor How does that work with real life like what is this look like vials

episode of yours was.

That was so good. We got into it on that one that was all behind the scenes of The Bachelor.

My only comment on The Bachelor and then we can ask for his toast who You would like to toast because we end each episode with our, our toasting. But I felt like Caitlin was such a good host of The Bachelor because or the bachelorette because she was very involved and added value to the show, like Chris Harrison did. And I think that this year, I mean, it was a dog on Jessie. Well, I feel like he didn’t have a lot of direction as far as like, if you didn’t see him a lot. He like Caitlin was on screen a good bit when she was the host. He wasn’t really present. And so then he would randomly show up and I’d be like, oh, yeah, there’s like, that’s the one supposed to be helping. But I feel like it should be more of the host job to say, hey, this actually is happening when you’re not around. Yeah, to see that too. It made me sad that the bachelor and bachelorette always have to wait until it airs to see what was going on when the camera crew and everybody else sees it in real time and knows that Clayton’s getting played or this person really is not a good person, but they don’t have any heads up until they watch it back when maybe the whole point of having the host would be to say, Hey, this is how

would a great analogy that is Jeff Probst does insert himself into survivor not only in the in the, what you call it in tribal council, but he actually will kind of like, steer the conversation so that things will come out or he knows things and you can still ask pointed questions, but you’re right in the Bachelor they don’t?

Well, I feel like Caitlin could actually give advice, and guidance and direction. Yeah. And this, it was just kind of lacking. So maybe anyway, you can just tell her she did a wonderful job. And my grandmother, my grandmother loves her and loves dancing with the stars and all of that. So she’s a big fan, big fan.

Message. That’s awesome. I think she did a great job too. So I’m, I’m on board. Everything you said I’m in. We’re in agreement there. And I’ll pass the message for sure.

Love it. And now I will digress. Okay, great. Do you have

to have a toast?

Yes, actually, I think that’s a perfect transition. So I have a five minute toast, I would toast. Well, I have a little bubbly sparkling water, I kind of wish it was real sparkling wine, but we gotta keep working. But my toast, I’ll maybe I’ll get a little spade sprouts today would be actually to Caitlyn. So it’s this week. And this is why it’s this week, she finishes Dancing with the Stars tour. So she’s been on tour with them for two and a half months. Her last show is March 16 in LA. And I think the coolest thing about that if if someone could take away any lesson from it, is that her whole entire kind of life, she was told she’ll never, she doesn’t have the skill set to dance professionally. And so she was cut and cut and cut. And so she had to take a detour. But while taking detours, she always talked about this dream and put it out there because when you talk about it, people will help you get to where you want to get. And so in a wild set of circumstances, there’s never been someone from the show of The Bachelor that went on Dancing with the Stars. Five years or so after they were on the show. Caitlin got on the show, won the show and as a result of winning has now been on tour for two and a half months literally living the dream that forever. She was told there’s no shot. And so if you continue to put your dreams out there, one you can manifest into you’ll be surprised and who will hear that pick up on it and find a way to help you out.

I love it. I’m curious to Caitlin’s here. Story. So how often in the last two and a half months while she’s been on tour, have y’all been able to see each other?

I’ve been new for shows now. So each one of those four shows I’ve been doing then there was one time she was close to Nashville unable to come back. So five, five different occasions and then your next week for the last show too. So six or seven aggregations? Not too bad.

Then you can get back to wedding planning.

Exactly right on. I like it.

Well, thank you. This has just been wonderful. Yeah.

Okay, you’re blurry. So I don’t really want to take a picture, but we’re going to take a picture anyway.

Okay, well, I say your one I’ll send you. Yeah, we’ll see how that one goes to

let’s we’ll take this one. Okay, smile. He’s like, okay, cool. Oh, yeah. Good. All right, perfect. Okay, Jason, really, this was huge for us. And we really, really appreciate you and it was so fun and we can’t wait for our audience to hear it. It will air I think March 28. So this month, in the month, but thank you. Yes.

Let us know when it all comes out and keep in touch and we’ll probably see it the next happy

thank you so much for tuning in to the hustle humbly podcast. Let us know who we should toast to for the next episode.

Be sure to follow us on Facebook and Instagram at hustle humbly podcast. If you have an episode topic or question please email eles add hustle humbly podcast@gmail.com

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Two Realtors fostering community over competition through light-hearted conversations.



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