Not sure if you are going to renew your license for next year? Are you stuck in a real estate rut? You’re not alone! In this episode, we’re tackling the tough decision of whether to renew your license when faced with financial struggles and a slow market. We’ll share stories from agents in the trenches, explore practical strategies for boosting your income, and offer mindset reminders to help you navigate this challenging season. Plus, we’ll dive into the importance of confidence and adaptability in your real estate career. We are even giving you a 6 question test to determine if it really is time to walk away. So, tune in and let’s figure out your next steps together!

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The following is a rough transcript provided by Otter.ai.

Alissa 0:01
And I’m like, Look, you’re great as a friend, but you’re not like, friendly, you’re

Katy 0:07
not friendly. That’s not for you.

Alissa 0:11
This client’s awful. This client’s me, this client’s needy. This listing won’t sell. It’s like, you

Katy 0:16
know what? The only thing in common with all of that,

Alissa 0:19
you right, if

Katy 0:20
you were there having denominator, I want permission to do it this way, or do it my way, or to not do it at all, for giving you the permission,

Alissa 0:29
yeah, to do what’s best for you and your family and your long term goals. Hi, y’all, welcome to hustle. Humbly, it’s Alyssa and Katie, and we are two top producing realtors in the Baton Rouge market. We

Katy 0:42
work for two different companies where we should be competitors, but we have chosen community over competition. The

Alissa 0:47
goal of our podcast is to encourage you to find your own way in business, so stop

Katy 0:51
comparing yourself and start embracing your strengths.

Alissa 0:54
Hey, Katie, oh, hi, Alyssa, ready.

Katy 0:57
I’m ready. It’s episode 271, sh, should you renew your license?

Alissa 1:05
I know that’s a hold on, tricky question. Hold

Katy 1:07
on, before we tackle the question, I brought you something to wear. Oh, what are these for? Put that on. I’m setting the scene, especially for our friends on YouTube. I brought myself a raspberry rose.

Alissa 1:18
Are we wearing our rose colored glasses. Puppy, and you put on your rose colored glasses. Okay, now I’m gonna have to ask you to take those off. Oh, because every new agent has on their rose colored glasses, and we need to take them off. It’s time to really take a good, hard look the reality, at the reality. So bye to the glasses. This episode is inspired by our inbox, yes, as many of them are yes that we know that there are a lot of agents struggling right now, not just financially, but also with mindset issues, feeling like they can make it. You know, we always say that it takes a good three years to really get your business established. But somebody I was talking to Roz actually, and she said, I think it’s five now.

Katy 2:11
I think it’s gotten longer.

Alissa 2:13
I think it’s gotten a little bit longer. And we would also like to remind you that the time doesn’t the timer doesn’t start on that until you do what you’re supposed to be doing, right? The work you get to do, the database. You’re communicating with your database, you’re showing up, you’re putting in the work, and then the clock starts. And by year three, now five, maybe you should be should have an idea of how your business is going to look long term. Yeah. So

Katy 2:43
what we want to talk about today is, how can you get into the small percentage that makes it past year three? Because if you’re new here, maybe you don’t know, 85% of agents, new agents do not make it past year 385. That’s a huge number, such a huge number. It’s still, I almost don’t even believe it, I know, but the truth is, so many people are always getting their license, so many of them that we don’t even realize. Okay, let’s read the couple of messages that were in our inbox, and then we’ll jump in. I have some really good lists to share with you all. So you want me

Alissa 3:17
to read this top one? Yeah, go for it. Okay, I’m struggling so much financially and with getting business. I work a part time job, but only a few hours a week so I can do real estate full time. I’m doing more business than any other new agent in my office, but still only selling a few homes a year and barely able to make ends meet. I truly love real estate, and I don’t want to give it up, but I’m starting to feel hopeless and like a failure, any words of wisdom would be so appreciated.

Katy 3:45
Okay, and then I’m gonna read the second one, which is the other end of the spectrum. I’ve been in the business for 12 years. It says 12. I’m truly struggling. I’m back to basics. Did 367 calls this month. I’ve also had some truly horrific deals. I consider myself resilient. I could use some encouraging words. I’m usually a top producer, and I haven’t sold 3 million this year. And I don’t remember when exactly that message arrived, but the point is, whether you’re new or you’re or have been around for a minute, it’s a struggle. It is a struggle. And we’re gonna do a whole episode on money, finances in a in a few more like, I think it’s 274, so we’re not gonna dive a lot into the financial part of it, but we are gonna ask ourselves some questions. Yeah, but how do we decide Do Do we when’s the time to give up? Why do you think

Alissa 4:39
I have noticed that it

Katy 4:41
is really hard for people to let go of real estate. Yeah, is it the law of diminishing returns is the one where you’ve all, I’ve already put so much time and money into this, I don’t want to stop now. What if I’m about to, like,

Alissa 4:53
turn the corner? Next one is my next thing. I’ll

Katy 4:56
just, I’ll just put some more money into Zillow leads. I. Just put some more. And then it’s just like, when, when is it okay to say enough? Right? Enough? Is enough? Well, good news. I have two choices about the past we can go down now. Do you want the question? Let’s not ask ourselves. We’re gonna get to the six questions to ask yourself if it’s time to quit. But first, let’s see what we should do when we feel like we want to quit. Okay? So maybe you’re just like, Oh, this isn’t working. What should I do if I feel like I want to quit? Here are the five things we want you to do. Are you ready? I’m going to let you even do some. They’re labeled number one. Evaluate your numbers. Look at the past. Okay, so if you’re brand new one or two years in, this is going to be trickier. But if you’re 12 years in real estate is cyclical. It’s not always up, up, up. Sometimes it’s down. So getting out, and I did this, well, probably back in 2020, honestly, my little career overview, yeah, which just quickly gives me the from year, the first year, all the way through. Now, how many transactions did I close that year? What was the average price, what was my volume, how much was my total net commission? And then what was happening in the big picture, like, what’s happening in the world, in the market, in my life, if I had a kid, this is important information. And then I could look at it and be like, Oh, okay, things are not so bad. When I go back and I take the what do they call it? Like the 30,000 Yeah, height view, like, okay, maybe it’s not as bad. Because when you’re having a slow month or a slow quarter or even a slow year, you’re like, I’m no good at this.

Alissa 6:35
As agents, we put so much value and our own self worth into our numbers, and so that is where the mindset struggle can really hurt you, yeah, but if you’re looking you know, as the messages have just poured in to hustle humbly about people who are struggling with all sorts of different areas, it’s like, okay, let’s look at it from this perspective. In 2024 we have had a major change in how we conduct our business. Yeah, national laws have been put in the plate into place. Horrible press about our career. Y’all that matters. It matters so much. Interest rates are higher, especially coming out of the covid interest rate. Yeah, the election is bringing about. Hey, certainty. How

Katy 7:26
many logs can we throw on this fire? How

Alissa 7:28
good Were you expecting to do you? But that’s

Katy 7:32
the problem. If all you ever knew was 2122 20 the beginning of 23 even you’re like, wait, what?

Alissa 7:40
What on earth,

Katy 7:42
if you started with your license in 2008 you would have been like, this is impossible. Yes, if you made it from then, Kuda, look, if you’ve got your license in 2008 and are still around, I’d love for you to shoot us a message, because that was the worst, 789, it was like nobody wanted to buy a house, and anyone who wanted to sell a house couldn’t, right? So looking at the past, looking at your numbers, that’s step one. Okay, do you want to do step two?

Alissa 8:12
Step two is to shift your mindset, which is what we were heading into if you need to go back and listen to episode three of our podcast, and remember, your mindset, not the market, determines your success,

Katy 8:29
right? I mean, it can’t be. What is the one that we did recently?

Alissa 8:32
Uh, positive the Oh yes. What’s

Katy 8:36
it called

Alissa 8:37
toxic positivity? Yes,

Katy 8:38
we’re not, we’re not saying just everything’s fine, but you’re my if you think everything’s bad, it’s sure gonna be. If you’re like, there are no buyers and sellers, then there aren’t for you.

Alissa 8:48
Yeah, I can certainly sit in any type of meeting and point out the ones that I’m like, if I felt the way that you felt about real estate, about your clients. If every time you’re talking, you’re venting, yeah, about how much you can’t stand your client. This client’s awful, this client’s mean, this client’s needy, this listing won’t sell. It’s like,

Katy 9:12
you know what? The only thing in common with all of that, you right? You were the common denominator. Every single seller was a problem. Probably not okay. Hold yourself okay. Well, that comes to the next one. Number three, hold yourself accountable. So when you feel like you want to quit, hold yourself accountable. Are you doing what you need to do? You love this one. Are you doing what you need to do? Do you have a plan for your business? Do you actually execute the plan? Like, if you say, I work past clients and referrals. How, how do you how do you get them? Do you talk to your database like, what are you holding yourself accountable to do?

Alissa 9:49
And it’s like, so simple. The people that I have conversations with that are struggling, and I say, How’s your database doing it? Well, I made my database and I’m like. That means nothing. Having their names written down means nothing, right? Do you interact with them on social media, on purpose? Are they in your phone? Can you text these people? Are they getting mail from you? Are they getting emails from you? Are they getting subdivision reports, like if you did nothing except focus all your efforts on building and growing your database. Yeah, but when I bring this up, it’s like people just are like, that’s not what I want to do. What do they want to they want to be at a brokerage that hands them leads. They think, okay, they for now. And I’m speaking based on people I have talked to, yeah, real people, real people who I have talked to that are struggling right now. People are jumping ship, switching brokerages, anyone who’s handing out free lead. And I’m like, you actually probably don’t want that business. That’s gonna be the hardest business. You think working a database is hard. It’s not

Katy 11:03
compared. Okay? Well, I love while we’re on that, we’re gonna put a pin in the thing, five things to do when you want to quit. And we’re gonna quickly, I’m gonna tell you seven reasons Realtors fail. Okay, from an Inman article that Jimmy Burgess, you know, my favorite contributor, wrote in March of 2023 okay, the seven reasons Realtors fail, and as I read the seven, I want you to give me a yes or a no. Maybe you agree, maybe you don’t. Reason number one, they are afraid of the phone. Yes, okay. Reason number two, they thought it was going to be easy. I think that should be like number one, okay. Reason number three, they lack discipline with their schedules. Yeah, okay. Number four, this is what, what you just said, made me go to this. Number four is they feel entitled. And in his the description of this, it was they feel entitled that the neighbor has to work with them, that their friends and their family have to work with them, like you got your license two minutes ago, and you think people owe you to work with you. They don’t. You have to prove yourself, or at least appear to be professional. Number five, they think they can do it part time. Yeah. Number six, they are too passive, okay. Number seven, they keep looking for the easy button. Yes, he’s always

Alissa 12:24
right. All of those are right. Bought one, right, but those are the seven reasons you’re gonna fail. One of my dear friends just became a commercial agent another market, and he was just so excited about this. I really think he’s going to be good at commercial, and he’s just very resilient. And I’m like, this is like, right up your alley. Okay. So I’m like, Well, how’s it going? And he’s like, um, well, you know, I thought I had a few sticks in the fire whenever I got my license. Like, Oh, my dad’s buddy wants to buy something over here and this wants to he was like, none of those things panned out, right? None of them. I have learned a lot. I’ve learned a lot about soil. I’ve learned a lot about regions and zoning. He’s like, I’m learning. I’m learning. Well, great. He was like, I’m not making any money new, but I am learning, and I’m realizing. Because I think when he was getting his license, he was like, I already have prospects. Yeah, you look at me, yo. I feel like I can always tell when someone’s new, when they’re so excited. Like, here can

Katy 13:39
I about a potential? Hand me those

Alissa 13:41
glasses. Yeah, your rose colored glasses. Those look very rosy. It’s almost like, you know, they’re like, someone came to an open house and said it was nice to meet me. I think I got my first contact. We’re back on. He’s

Katy 13:54
just not that into you, like, and I’m

Alissa 13:57
just like, oh, okay, that’s great. Did you get their contact? Did

Katy 14:01
you ask if they had an age? Yeah? Like,

Alissa 14:03
No, I didn’t do any of that. Oh, okay, but it’s like, best of luck to you. I know it was just interesting to me talking to him while he was getting his license, and then three weeks later, just

Katy 14:16
three weeks he was already, like, disillusioned.

Alissa 14:19
He was like, Okay, well, he’s like, I mean, I’m not giving up or anything. I just am realizing it’s not going exactly like I thought it would, right, like, just because I had these potential, that’s the thing. Nobody wants to hear this. But real estate is a long

Katy 14:33
game, and especially commercial, yeah, even longer, right? Oh, my word.

Alissa 14:40
So that, I think, is what makes people and then they’re like, Well, I’ve done this for six years, 10 years, and I’m like, Yes, but how much have you been full time, and how much of it did you give yourself a schedule that you stuck to because there’s

Katy 14:59
so much what. Were busy work. They’re doing something, right, but it’s busy work, right? I

Alissa 15:05
spent all day making a flyer, and I didn’t get any I went to the agent tour with my office. Right? Seemed working now like, did

Katy 15:13
you post any content while you were there? Nope, not work. Did

Alissa 15:15
you meet a single person? Nope. Did you comment on anybody’s social media, just checking in on their life.

Katy 15:21
Nope, okay, let’s go back to when do, what to do when you feel like you want to quit. Okay, all right, so

Alissa 15:27
hold yourself accountable. Is where we got stuck. Okay. Number four, go ahead, realistically, ask yourself, How long can you handle the slow times financially? Yeah, this is huge. Yeah?

Katy 15:41
Like, maybe you’re really worked up about it, but you have money in the bank. Like, you know that if you keep doing what you’re supposed to be doing, that eventually, because it’s a long game. But if you’re desperate for money today, I don’t see how you’re going to be able to come from the right mindset to get business. Yeah, it’s going to be tough, very tough, very tough.

Alissa 16:05
Those are the ones who I feel are forced to make the decision. But even then, I see people hang on so much longer past that,

Katy 16:15
right? And it’s expensive to have your license, which, again, we’re going to talk finances in a different episode, but it is important to think how long. Maybe it’s longer than you thought. Maybe you have a three pound window, and you need to calm down. What if

Alissa 16:27
you’re like, I don’t have money, and we’re gonna get to that on another episode

Katy 16:32
in this one. Just, just put a pin up for a second. Gotcha? Okay? Because we’re gonna do, I’ll just give you a little sneak peek. We’re gonna do the six questions to ask yourself to decide if it’s time to quit. Oh yeah, okay, so hang tight. But right now, let’s get our last what to do when you feel like quitting. Yes, we’re still in our feelings. Yeah, think outside of the box. Okay, okay, that’s what you need to do. So maybe you need to work rentals. Maybe you’re like, Oh no, anything that you were too good for before you’re not too good for if you’re, like, really struggling, take on a rentals offer one off staging, maybe you need to go to your past clients or your sphere and be like, Hey, I’m doing paint recommendations for the spring. Or, you know, if you need a new front door color, I’ll come over and pick out a color for you for 25 bucks or 100 bucks, or whatever style. Some bookshelves. You know, I did it for fun for a minute, because I just enjoy it so much. But I was like, Well, let me just test this. And I’m like, Hey, I will come style your bookshelves for $250 plus whatever I buy for them if you want me to get some extra stuff. Yeah, two or three people paid me $250 happily for me to come style their bookshelves? Yeah, I mean, so and

Alissa 17:43
those are things that you’re taking before and after, pictures you’re showing staging it is still in the real estate realm of Do you know why it is so important to style your bookshelves before your listing photos? Yeah, you are tying it all back together, which is why I think that works. Yeah,

Katy 18:03
I did, you know, maybe do curb appeal upgrades or literally paint physically like, what can you do? There’s got to be something that you can do. Okay, so let’s go down this rabbit hole a little bit. If you’re thinking outside of the box, you’re gonna have to pick another source of income, right? If you’re really struggling. So where can you make a few quick bucks? Rentals are fast, like all the things we just talked about, or maybe there’s something else. Can you think of anything else?

Alissa 18:30
If it was me, I would be in my I did this in the beginning. I just didn’t ask for payment. And I totally could have but it’s fine going to agents in your office and saying, Hey, I’m available if you I have made a a la carte menu. If you need me to meet a photographer, if you need me to meet a termite inspector, I want to learn. Here’s the thing, my people also don’t believe me, but like, I did not miss a Sunday open house my first year, right? I and it was hard for me to go on Sunday, yes, like, now I don’t mind it as much, because it’s like a break from my kids. Then it was like I was having to leave brunch early to make it to my open houses, like I had other plans. But, I mean, there’s so much that you can offer. Yeah, the agents that I’ll speak as a as a top producing agent, the second anybody has ever come to me and said, Hey, if you ever I’m like, yes, yeah, I’ll do showings for 50 bucks, right? If I’m ever in a bind, I’m like, saving their name. It’s almost

Katy 19:33
like getting babysitter names. Yes. You’re like, wait what?

Alissa 19:37
You’ll do this. You’re a good babysitter. Okay, yeah, yeah, great. Write you down.

Katy 19:42
Okay, so if you’re trying to think of something to think outside the box, like, ask yourself, What’s your passion? What are you really good at? Can you break out some easy income, like, what’s your niche? Also for talking about working for other agents? What about updating websites or setting up templates or doing canvas like? Hey, I’ll get you a set of Canva templates for your flyers and this and that and whatever. Going forward, I’m great with Canva. I’m happy to do it 150 bucks, 200 bucks whatever, like, whatever. So there’s, I mean, anything like that. And then I said, are you telling people that you’re looking to make extra money, or are you hiding it because you’re embarrassed. So like, if you’re looking for, and it doesn’t even have to be people in the world, it could be people in your office, hey, I’m just, like, you just said, I’m free. I’m looking to make a little extra money if you need someone to run do a showing, or termite certificate or whatever. Yeah. So just, like, think about it. Mindset wise, are you pretending like everything’s fine, but you really do need to find some quick money, like, maybe you’re just gonna have to put yourself out there. We’ve even had

Alissa 20:46
a few agents in our office that offered to work the front desk. Oh, because it’s like you’re in the office, you’re at the computer. Yeah, the phone rings. You answer, you transfer it. You know you’re you’re helping out with some paperwork, but it’s keeping you in that real estate vibe. Yeah,

Katy 21:04
the other thing I had to say about we’ve noticed in our messages that a lot of agents are also finding part time jobs. I think that it’s okay being a part time agent is a lot less of an issue if you don’t have any clients, right, right, like, right, it’s okay. It’s I’m like, you can’t be a full time agent with no clients at all, correct, right? Like, you’re gonna have to have some clients. So as long as you pick another part time gig that gives you the freedom to work professionally when you do get a client, like, as long as you can work in business hours, as long like, I think that’s okay. I think that saying we prefer you to be a full time agent is if you have business like if you have no business and you need a part time job, that’s totally fine. But what’s your plan? Yes, how will you serve the clients you do get professionally? Okay? You want some mindset reminders. Yeah, okay, here are a few mindset reminders. Making an adjustment doesn’t mean you’re a failure. Okay? It is not a reflection of who you are as a person. If you make the decision to quit,

Alissa 22:11
like y’all really so many people in my that I have talked to, I’m like, it’s so hard for me to hear them and understand what’s keeping them here and but it is just this pull that real estate has on you at times where the dream is. It’s like, right there, so close, but I’m like, but it’s been eight years. Well, right? If you’re still not like, maybe it’s just not your calling, your passion, and if it’s making you a depressed person, right? It’s not bringing out the best in you, no. So maybe there is something that would bring out the best in you that would make

Katy 22:50
you less stressed, okay? Other mindset reminders, taking what the market is giving you and making smart decisions is something to be proud of, yeah, like making adjustments and being adaptable is something to be proud of. And now is the time to survive, and later will be the season of thriving. Remember our generations from Episode 257 like we’re all just trying to survive right now. Yeah, so that’s how to show you our Realtors that episode. So we’re trying to be survivalist. Just make it through it might not be a thriving season. All right, those are my mindset reminders. Those were great any thoughts,

Alissa 23:27
I think a lot of people need to hear that, and I’ve said just as much. And when I really am like poking these people who are talking to me and I’m like, what? What’s making you want to be here? Yeah, they really can’t say. It’s like, they can’t verbal. Well, I liked the idea of having a job that was flexible enough to let me right, be with my kids more, or it’s like, but what good is that, if this career is belittling you so much, yeah, that it’s affecting your self confidence, it’s affecting your happiness, right? But then it’s like, when I do see people that have left confidently, yeah, I’m almost a little jealous. Oh, that’s awesome. They were like, what’s

Katy 24:11
that saying? Are you gonna fish or cut bait? It’s like, it’s okay, sometimes it’s okay to walk away, yeah?

Alissa 24:18
But the people who were like, look, that was not for me, or that was so hard, or I had to get a job that paid me every two weeks. Look, that’s true for a lot of people. And I remember someone saying that so confidently and, like, unselfconscious, and they were

Katy 24:34
like, I don’t care if it’s less money overall, I

Alissa 24:36
just need, I need a name. I was thinking, that does sound kind of nice. That

Katy 24:40
is enticing, that is a bit enticing, right? Yeah, there’s no shortage of jobs out there in the world. All right, so is it time to quit? Are you ready to ask yourself these six questions? Is it time? Because, look, we are positive on the podcast, and obviously we would put ourself out of business if you. All quit and didn’t listen anymore. Want you

Alissa 25:03
to quit, but we want you to do what’s best for you. Yes. So

Katy 25:06
here are the questions, is it time to quit? Ask yourself these six. Where did you question in my brain?

Alissa 25:13
These are going to be good? Oh, I

Katy 25:14
hope so. There’s a lot of pressure, so feel free to add some questions if you want. I am I able to keep going without accruing debt? Okay, so these are just yes, no questions, and I want you to just think in your head or jot a yes, no ready? Am I able to keep going without accruing debt? This is huge, okay, can I last several more months without going into debt. Okay, okay. Do I have a plan for getting business and am I working it regularly? So do I have a business plan? Do I know what kind of clients I’m looking for? How do I work it? Am I working it regularly? Yes or No. Next question, am I willing or able to work harder than I am currently working. This is amazing. Yes or No. Do I enjoy the work when I do have it? Yes or no.

Alissa 26:15
These are great. So

Katy 26:15
do I enjoy it? Okay? Yes or no. And the last question is, Do I like talking to people? I know it’s silly, but it’s yes or no. Do you like talking to people?

Alissa 26:27
So my friend who went the commercial route was discussing residential first, okay, and I’m like, Look, you’re great as a friend, but you’re not like friendly, you’re not

Katy 26:42
friendly. That’s not for you. Okay, so if you answered three or more no’s, it might be time to quit.

Alissa 26:51
I think that’s fair. Did

Katy 26:53
you feel like good questions? You have some others. I

Alissa 26:57
think those are perfect questions. Debt is a real hole that is very hard to get out of, especially

Katy 27:05
if you’re someone that’s already in, like a student loan debt or, like, if you have other debt, and then you just keep I will tell you I came across an agent who was telling me her story, and she basically was like, I’m putting all of my realtor fees on a credit card. My credit cards were all paid off, and I am having to pay because I haven’t sold anything yet. And I’m like, There’s only so long that that makes sense. Yeah, right. At some

Alissa 27:36
point, you know, people are so worried about what people think, and it’s like, at some point, though, it’s admirable to be honest with yourself and say, Look family, right? This is where we’re at. The numbers are not working. I cannot continue to do this right at this pace, right

Katy 27:54
now, I will say maybe you don’t need to quit. Maybe even if you answered three or more no’s, what if you put your license inactive, can you move it to an inactive status until you are in a better financial position? Maybe that means you go get a job for a year or whatever, but until you’re ready and have a three or six month runway, then you come back to it. And it was funny, because you noticed it today, and I noticed it yesterday, our lrec, our our commission, and a Real Estate Commission sent out an email yesterday that was like, should you put your license in in active status?

Alissa 28:32
I was like, we’re just about to record on this. I’m like, how did they know? And I think this year, with all the major changes we’ve had, there is going to be a larger amount of people that are actually going to retire, yeah, like, you know the little one two transactions every other year. People might be like, I don’t know that. I want to I’ve seen a lot of people this year who got licensed during covid, when their career jobs became work from home or laid off altogether. People quickly got their real estate license, made some quick bucks. Now they’re like, I’m gonna go back. Yeah, job. And they’ve said, Oh, I

Katy 29:11
went back. Like, it wait. They’re like, I needed the you were getting consistently paid when the market was good, yeah, now you’re not getting consistently paid. We’re gonna figure out who’s gonna be able to handle that. Well, are

Alissa 29:23
you willing to work harder? And I think that’s a question for everybody, yes. Right now in the market we’re in, whether you are new or have been doing this, I’m having to ask myself, Alyssa, your listings, as we just discussed, are not flying off the shelf. Like,

Katy 29:38
are you willing to work harder? You

Alissa 29:40
have to work harder right now. Yeah. Is it like that forever? No, but I know that there are seasons where I have had to work so much harder, yeah, and only you can answer that for yourself and you, it’s so hard for people to answer that honestly, right? Like,

Katy 29:56
yeah, I can work harder. Hoorah. Let’s do this and then for a. Or two, you’re like, doing it well, then

Alissa 30:02
one of your questions was, am I working? And so many people are so fast to say, yes, yeah. Like you said, you know, I went to my sales meeting, and then I went on tour and and then I picked up my kids. And it’s like, okay, but when did you talk to humans? Did you open your spreadsheet at all? Yeah. And I also can tell if they’re immediately jumping to excuses, yeah.

Katy 30:26
Well, my broker said they were gonna give me leads, and they haven’t given

Alissa 30:29
me any, right? Well, I don’t know that many people here, so I don’t really my database isn’t huge. It only has like 20 people on it.

Katy 30:36
I do about that, right? But even if you don’t talk to the 20. Don’t kid yourself. You can have a great business with 20 people who love you and would refer you.

Alissa 30:47
Yeah, think about that spiderweb. How far it can read people who have

Katy 30:51
huge databases don’t maybe they only have one or two or three key referrers, people who always, if you had all 20 of your people, were like, wow, we’re

Alissa 31:00
gonna send you referrals, right? If each person sends you two referrals of your on your 20 person database, you wouldn’t be

Katy 31:08
able to handle it. It’s more than you would want to do in that year. It’s more than you would most people. When you ask them, say, I want to do 24 transactions. That’s like, the kind of,

Alissa 31:16
yeah, two a month, which is gonna get it. I get a paycheck every other week, right?

Katy 31:21
Which is funny, because the actual average for agents is like 11 or 12, yeah, but everyone will say, I want 24 which is fine. Everyone wants to double it. But even then, if you had 20 people and they each sent you two, you’re getting 40 trans. You don’t want to do 40. It’s a different lifestyle. Yeah, it’s a different lifestyle. I

Alissa 31:40
also think speaking about debt and spending money, there are so many products out there targeting these people, yeah, oh, yeah, that promise, if you buy this, do this, you will be successful. And we must stop listening to that lie, yeah, because during this time, if you’re in this place, you need to be asking, How can I do this without spending more money? If it costs money, don’t do it right now. Like, that’s an immediate No, you don’t need to be doing mailers like to subdivision. What are they saying? Pay yourself first. But I think that’s the same with like this mentality. It’s like the business has to make money, yes, before it can spend money. You can’t spend money on marketing if you have no money. So we really need to watch what we’re spending our money on, yeah, like our office right now, you know is going through our transition with new signs there. The company is giving us signs for free. Okay? If you want special signs, you pay for them. It is extra. I am not even paying for the new extra ones. Just like, give me the regular ones. I’m like, yeah, just give me the regular ones. I don’t care. Like, right? But I see agents who I know just in our meeting, are struggling, struggling, struggling, spending so much money on things that I know are not going to bring you a return. Yeah? Like, what kind of return are we getting here? So I just that’s, it’s hard to have these honest questions with yourself. Yeah, and have you ever thought about quitting real estate? Me personally, since you started

Katy 33:22
only after the podcast. Yeah, and at first I had so much resistance. I’m like, This is too hard to do both. Like, I can’t figure out how to be in two lanes and grow a real estate business and grow a different but, like, it’s just it was too much, and now I’m totally fine, because I never didn’t love real estate, right? I always loved it, but it’s like you sometimes you only have so much bandwidth for what you can do, right? And now I just work with less clients, and I don’t feel embarrassed about that. I feel like this is what makes sense. I didn’t want to leave real estate. I just needed to adjust. What I felt like was my goal for it, yeah, so it’s fine, but before that, no, I thought I would be selling real estate until I was 70, yeah, like, before this, I didn’t see the end of real estate. I liked it, and I didn’t, I mean, I never, I mean, I had some not great years, but I never got so bad that I was like, Yeah, I had a job. I have to get a job. I just didn’t see anything else that was like, Oh, that’s it, yeah, that’s the calling same,

Alissa 34:28
yeah. I think this year was my first year that I found sort of my capacity. Yeah, because you’ve asked me before, throughout the years, like, well, how many transactions is too many, right? And what’s weird is I found my capacity at a time when it wasn’t the most transactions I had ever dealt with. Yeah, it was at a time when I actually only had a few transactions, but I had very disgruntled clients, and I

Katy 34:58
think that’s due to the harder. Market? Yes, like in an easy market, it’s easier to do more transactions in a hard market, emotionally and the workload, it’s just different, right? One listing is going to take you three months to sell in a hard market. Well, then that means you’ve got to work the one listing for the whole three months, because I

Alissa 35:17
had those like two or three that were super hard the whole time. Yeah, and I’m usually pretty tough, and maybe I had let my guard down a little bit, but those had me not thinking about getting out of real estate, but just reevaluating life. Like I was like, Oh my gosh, I’m actually, I have found my limit. I actually cannot handle another unhappy or difficult, right? I remember the episode you said you were gonna work with dogs, yeah, just dogs, just dogs, and I’m gonna go be a barista now. Yeah? I

Katy 35:49
mean, look, take a break. You know, do you want to talk for a minute about confidence or adapting? I did a little research. There was a TED talk on adapting by Natalie freto or frato, and she said there were three ways to measure adaptability and to improve your adaptability. Okay, number one was to ask yourself, what if questions so like, what if I don’t get another client for two months. What if this client takes me X amount of time to work with? What if this new listing takes six months to sell, and then you kind of work through like, how many like, how many answers to the what if question can you find, right? Okay, that’s kind of helping you grow and expand your ability for adaptability, okay?

Alissa 36:41
And I think this is really helpful, because I do think a lot of agents that are in the position of struggling are in denial, yeah, right, that’s why it’s so hard to answer these questions that we’re supposed to ask ourselves in an honest manner. I do work hard. I am working. I am working, but they are actually in denial. And I think that, you know, I’ve talked before about how I interviewed three brokerages, right? And the first two, I left so excited about real estate, I almost didn’t even go interview. Thank God you went to the third one. And then she, she said, what if you don’t sell a house your first years. She did the what ifs she did? And I went, Uh, well, she’s like, Well, do you do do you have a spouse that helps you? And I was like, No, I’m single right now. Like, whoa. She’s like, Okay, well, what about your family? Your parents? I’m like, I don’t ask them for money. Like, no. She’s like, Well, how do you make money? I was like, I bartend, but it’s just me. I don’t need much, you know, yeah. And she prepared me for not selling a house my first year, yeah? So that when I did, you’re like, look at this money. She I was so excited instead of, well, took me eight months, but here’s the first house, finally, yeah, like she was framing my expectations and my mindset. And what’s funny is, at the end of my first year, I did pretty well, and I told her, I said, you said, you know that I wouldn’t sell house. And she was like, I knew you were gonna sell house, but I gotta set you gotta

Katy 38:16
be prepared. Yeah, how many months until your first one? Five? Mine was six,

Alissa 38:23
and the house was like, $105,000

Katy 38:25
Oh, right, my check was mine definitely didn’t break 200,000 Yeah, back in the beginning of my career, in 2005 and six, I my dad built a spec house, like, at maybe two on six or seven. And he was like, I’ll let you list it for $347,000 and I was like, this is, like, the most expensive house I’ve ever even been inside of wow, yeah. Okay, so the other three, so three ways to measure adaptability. One is the what, what if questions. Two is to get comfortable with UN learning. So whatever you think the way is, are you comfortable with trying a different way? If you think the only way is online leads, if the only way is open, whatever it is, if you’re just so stuck in your way and you’re not willing to unlearn that and relearn something different. You’re not adapting. I have a

Alissa 39:24
story. Oh, good. And also, kilo is snoring kind of loud, pretty loudly in the background. So yeah, like, sorry. We thought he’d let him stay in here, but he is really confident. Okay,

Katy 39:35
well, I hope it doesn’t put anyone to sleep. Yeah.

Alissa 39:38
So I found, you know, on my coffee date era, the ones that started repeating, yeah, okay, so it was like, I’m talking about, I’m

Katy 39:46
just gonna move his head. Yeah,

Alissa 39:48
he’s really snoring loud. He’s like, oh, sorry, am I snoring? There we go. Sorry, guys, I would meet. Eat these agents for coffee. Okay? Nobody really liked what I had to say about building your business, having a database, it takes time to form relationships. This is the best business. Takes a little telling you the truth, but it’s literally like their response is like, well, that’s not fast enough. No, I’m not gonna do that. Three years later, same person, same people, I can think of more than one. Oh, my word. Hey, you want to meet up. Haven’t seen you in forever. We meet up, and it’s the same thing. Oh man. And I’m thinking, if you would have started, then you’d be done, you’d be done, you’d

Katy 40:36
be on the train. We’re three years in, yeah, and you’re still doing the same thing, because you thought it would be faster, right? But it hasn’t happened. You know what I picture like? You know the movies when the train is going on the tracks and someone’s running after the train, and they’re trying to run faster and faster to jump on the back of the train? Yes, that first three years is you running to get on the train, right? Just running, running after the train we’re trying to get on. If you run fast enough and you work hard enough, you will jump on the train. And then once you’re on it, you’re kind of like, oh, okay, now I’m on it, and it’s like, it’s almost hard to get off the train, right? Yes, like, the business will pretty, be pretty if you keep doing the stuff that you did, and if you really put the time into it, it’s hard to get off the train. Like, that’s the I mean, like, your business just doesn’t go away if you keep working it right. Okay, you want the last adaptability measure, yeah, infusing exploration. Oh, previous success can be an enemy to your adaptability.

Alissa 41:42
Oh, this might be happening with what with the agent that wrote in in her year 12? Yeah, she’s like, I’m used to having these huge years, and I haven’t even sold 3 million this year

Katy 41:53
so. And actually, in this TED talk from Natalie fretto, she tells the story of of blockbuster. If you’re not old enough, then you won’t know, but blockbuster, Blockbuster video stores were on every corner, literally, y’all everywhere, like, almost like a Walgreens or CVS. They were on every corner. You go in and rent your videos, right? And then as the early 2000s come, they do shift to a model where you could also get the movies in the mail, you know, a la, Netflix, yes, and you could still go and rent your videos. Okay, fine. And then the CEO of blockbuster has this other CEO person come or at the time, I don’t even know if it was a CEO, come over and be like, hey, I want to help you prepare your business. And, like, change your business. And like, you know, get ready for the future. And the CEO of blockbuster is like, that’s stupid. I have 100 million customers. I’m on X million, you know, 1000s of locations. I don’t need you. Everything’s fine. And then time goes by, the person who came to his office actually ends up being the CEO of Netflix. As you may know, Netflix is still around, and I don’t remember the numbers, but it’s billions of dollars, right? And blockbuster filed bankruptcy in like the 2010s 2016 2010s somewhere, yes, because blockbuster was willing to exploit its past and its current model, and it wasn’t willing to infuse any exploration. Yeah, it was successful in the past. Oh, this

Alissa 43:32
worked. Yeah, I’m just gonna keep on doing this.

Katy 43:34
Like, you gotta have your wits about you. You’re like the the landscape is changing, whether you want it to or not. So those are your adaptability measures. Yeah, fascinating. I was, it was a cute, short little video. But the stories about Blockbuster and Netflix are, there’s a bunch of them.

Alissa 43:55
Well, there’s so many parallels to life within that yeah and adapting yeah and yeah. I agree. I think that too, even me, when I started hitting some of the big numbers and then going back down a little, it felt bad. You’re like, oh no, oh no. But it’s like, no, that’s you had children, and the market has different things change. Yeah, the season of life, Season of Life, Season of Life, cycles of the market, you actually handle right where you are, right now,

Katy 44:24
right. Okay, last thing I wanted to bring up, as we talk about, should you quit and is, where does confidence fit into all of this? Okay, so it kind of goes hand in hand with our mindset reminders. But confidence is that little magic piece of the puzzle, right? That will get it will solve so many of the pains in your business, right? So if you don’t feel confident asking buyers and sellers to work with you and pay you, you’re gonna struggle. Like, this is the basis level of it. Like, if you don’t know and. And we just can’t afford in this type of a market to lose a warm lead because I wasn’t confident, right? Like, oh, if your neighbor mentioned something about maybe moving and you’re like, oh, you know, like, if you don’t have your confidence down right now, so you’re,

Alissa 45:16
don’t let anything slip through your fingers. You can’t

Katy 45:18
let anything slip through your fingers, because it’s our confidence and our competence that people know and will read from us. So I just wanted to say you need to keep that where it needs to be. You can use your education to Grow your confidence and your confidence. You can go to classes, at your office, at your board. You know, listen to the podcast. There’s so many ways to, for free, build your confidence and your competence. Yeah, and then you won’t lose those little bit of leads that are out there. We can’t lose any. We can’t lose any.

Alissa 45:51
I wrote down, whether you think you can or you think you can’t, you’re right, you’re right, you’re right.

Katy 45:57
One of my favorites, I know, so I hope this was helpful, yeah, and I hope if you’re listening and you’re like, you know what, real talk, this is not for me, please know you’re always welcome here. Yeah, we’re still here for you. You can always listen. You can always come back. If they have an inactive status where you are, try that

Alissa 46:18
if you’re letting you get on your feet, take a breather. Right, right,

Katy 46:23
reset. Wait for a market up, you know, or wait for you to save up some money, like, whatever it might take. Or if you’re just like, this just isn’t for me. You’re right. I don’t like talking to people. It’s okay to be like, I’m gonna do something else. Now, Gary Vee talks a lot about how people put so much pressure on themselves when they’re young, like before the age of 25 or before the age of 30, I have to know what I’m going to do, or before I go to college, I have to know what I want to do. And he’s like, your 20s should be trying as many different things as you possibly can to find the one that you actually like, that you’re actually good at, that you actually want to do. There’s no shame in changing course, right? Like, there’s just no shame in saying, You know what? That actually wasn’t a fit for me. I mean, I could have stayed in retail management. Yeah, that was not a fit for me. Like, no, thank you. Yeah. So he’s like, your life is so long, and all of these old ideologies are based on people living until 60 or barely 70, or like, retiring. You know, always at 65 people are working well into their 70s. Oh, yeah, you have so much time to change course. Think about how many second career Realtors they are. So many, they were a whole nother thing, and now they’re a realtor, yeah? Like, that’s actually really common, very common. So I hope this is your calling, and that you’re feeling more positive, yeah?

Alissa 47:53
And we’d love to hear from y’all Yeah. They all are doing I know,

Katy 47:59
if it’s not for you, it’s okay. Yeah, it’s totally okay.

Alissa 48:03
I hope this is actually helpful. I think it is. I think it was good, good, hard questions. Sometimes we gotta really evaluate ourselves, yeah.

Katy 48:11
And I think our listeners specifically are, are actually any Realtors really are always looking for permission. I want permission to do it this way, or do it my way, or to not do it at all. We’re giving you the permission, yeah,

Alissa 48:23
to do what’s best for you and your family and your long term goals, like, what do you need? If this is putting you into debt, stop it. Right? No more debt. Right now, no

Katy 48:34
more Okay, that’s all I have. Okay, great. Well, let’s

Alissa 48:37
do a toast. Okay? Goodbye.

Speaker 1 48:39
Hi everyone. Realtor Rochelle from Portland, Oregon, I’m gonna give a toast to one of the girls I love most, Stacey Hartzler, also located in Portland, Oregon, her and I totally believe in community over competition, and that is one reason why we love listening to hustle humbly. I just want to toast you, Stacy for always being in my corner, being someone I can turn to in business and personal life, I love you to pieces, and I hope that you have a great and successful year. Thanks everyone for listening to hustle humbly. I just love these girls. Thank

Alissa 49:13
you so much for tuning in to the hustle humbly podcast. If

Katy 49:16
you enjoyed this episode, please go to rate this podcast.com/hustle. Humbly and leave us a review or drop a comment if you’re listening on Spotify, if

Alissa 49:23
you have an episode topic or someone you’d like to toast on the show, please email us at team. At hustle humbly. Podcast.com, find

Katy 49:31
us on social media at hustle humbly. Podcast, don’t forget to find all of the free resources at hustle humbly. Podcast.com/resources,

Alissa 49:39
see you next week. This is the good life.